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Better to strip to bare metal or just sand bad spots and recoat?

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Hstamper Avatar
Hstamper Silver Member Rick Coshow
Shelton, WA, USA   USA
1972 MG MGB
I stripped my 72 B and sprayed epoxy primer on sometime around 1998. The car sat for ~10 years in the garage while I did other projects around it. Then, in 2008 after lightly re-sanding and many cleanings with whatever special solvent the paint shop recommended I painted it with urethane (and hardener). That was ~2008. The car looks good but has spots, mainly around the rear fender seam on top, where the paint is bubbling. I assume rust is under the bubble. The bubbling is minimal and few people notice.

My question is when I talk to paint folks on the phone to get estimates they want to strip it and charge me $3000 to paint it. I think that all it needs is to have the bubbles sanded away and another coat of paint. I know if your car has multiple coats of paint or any coats of questionable quality you strip. But I was very meticulous and did all the steps the paint dealers recommended when I stripped and sealed and later when I painted. And it has been 10 years since I painted and there are no new bad spots. Has anyone else had to think about this?

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tvrgeek Avatar
tvrgeek Silver Member Scott S
Hillsborough, North Carolinia, USA   USA
1965 MG MGB
You must sand epoxy before a primer/sealer to give it tooth or it will not bond.



Cogito ergo sum periculoso

NOHOME P P
O, ON, Canada   CAN
1967 MG MGB GT "Maggie (GT From Hell)"
I would do a spot repair. wire wheel the bejeezus out of the rusty bead, treat the area with a rust converter and then blend in a repair. Easy if it is solid color single stage, but done all the time with base clear metalics. 3k is kinda crazy $$$

Call up a paintless dent repair guy. He may or may not do the job ( not all paintless dent removal is successful) but he will know the guy you need.

Pete

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Rick Fawthrop Avatar
Rick Fawthrop Richard Fawthrop
Langley, WA, USA   USA
Are there people in Shelton that would strip a car to bare metal and repaint for 3k?

tvrgeek Avatar
tvrgeek Silver Member Scott S
Hillsborough, North Carolinia, USA   USA
1965 MG MGB
3K for just a shoot of a already prepped car is more like it. ( clean, color, color sand, clear, sand and buff) You have a basic materials incompatibility problem that unless corrected, will cause issues further down the line. Disassembly, strip, repair, body work, prime, seal, paint, reassemble... 8K at least.

First, sand down and find out why you are getting bubbles. Is is rust, or is is the topcoat is not bonded to the epoxy?. If you are very lucky, maybe rust ( yea, lucky?) but more likely that urethane does not stick to epoxy primer.

Sand down to the epoxy. No need to go to metal unless repairs are needed. Prime/seal then paint. Do read the instructions for all the materials. Epoxy primers make it clear that unless primed within an hour, they require sanding. They still require primer sealer over them. I can't tell you what grit. It should be in the instructions for the epoxy.



Cogito ergo sum periculoso

Hstamper Avatar
Hstamper Silver Member Rick Coshow
Shelton, WA, USA   USA
1972 MG MGB
Yes, if I strip the car.

cstrong45 Avatar
cstrong45 Charles Strong
Bainbridge Island, WA, USA   USA
In reply to # 3737266 by Hstamper Yes, if I strip the car.

Shouldnt it be cheaper if you don't strip the car?

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Hstamper Avatar
Hstamper Silver Member Rick Coshow
Shelton, WA, USA   USA
1972 MG MGB
Someone asked if there was someone in Shelton who would strip and paint for 3K. Yes, a paint shop said they could do it if I strip the car. It's a lot of work (windshield, bumpers, lights, trim) and they the shop strips it they are liable for anything broken. And if I strip it they have very little taping to do.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-05-16 01:02 PM by Hstamper.

Benny Avatar
Benny Ben E
San Diego, CA, USA   USA
In reply to # 3737145 by tvrgeek Epoxy primers make it clear that unless primed within an hour, they require sanding. They still require primer sealer over them.

I think it’s worth emphasizing here that the user should read the instructions for THEIR product.

I’ve been using Southern Polyurethanes epoxy primer for years, and you can certainly spray top coat directly over their epoxy, and you can do that for up to about 48 hours....in fact, I believe they recommend waiting 24 hours in “typical” conditions. Their recoat window for additional primers or sealers is up to 7 days!

Be careful with blanket statements on paint procedures.

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Rick Fawthrop Avatar
Rick Fawthrop Richard Fawthrop
Langley, WA, USA   USA
I would send the car out to put and have the rust sandblasted. I see no reason to strip the rest of the car.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-05-16 06:46 PM by Rick Fawthrop.

71 B Avatar
71 B paul duncan
Chapel Hill, NC, USA   USA
In today's dollars, $3k for an all over is inexpensive, even on a car the size of a B.

Using quality materials, there's at least $1000 in paint, clear, primer, paper, abrasives, etc. (no body work). At my shop, we do a basic sand and squirt (with minimal disassembly) for double that. If we are dealing with rust, that's additional. $3k buys about a weeks worth of restoration labor. That translates to a car being prepped, masked, primed, painted, cleared and reassembled in three days by one guy. I would love to find employees that can do that!

Also know that if the epoxy has rust bubbles, the surface most likely wasn't prepped properly. Rust bubbles forming indoors, under epoxy suggests that you may have a bigger problem than you think.

I'd suggest fixing it with minimal paint work.

tahoe36c Avatar
tahoe36c Paul Hruza
Panama City, FL, USA   USA
1969 MG MGC GT "Little Red Rocket..."
1972 MG MGB GT "Tiny Dancer"
2002 Harley-Davidson Dyna
Rick,

How about a picture (close up with a ruler to judge size) of these "bubbles"? How big are they? Where are they located on the car? It seems as though you used single stage paint. Are you sure it was sprayed correctly when it was done? Paint can bubble if there is not enough time between coats as it releases carbon dioxide gas from the previous coat... The bubbles are tiny, but noticeable if you look hard enough. Ask me how I know! Please determine if these bubbles are actually caused by corrosion before jumping to any conclusions.

I would definitely NOT repaint the entire car either way... Single stage is easy to touch up compared to base/clear.

earlspoint Avatar
earlspoint Richard Earls
OAK HARBOR, WA, USA   USA
My thoughts also 3k in a heart beat. that's a 12k job out here.
Spot repairs are fine but it is all in the prep. Due to different paints reacting against each other. seal it after the repairs, prime, block, prime, block before painting.



Vietnam Vet 1971-1973

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