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Putting a water choke back ON a '75

Moss Motors
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tdskip Tom Smith
SoCal, CA, USA   USA
1959 MG MGA
My DPO removed the water choke and put ones of those impossible to sort out red manual choke things on. Doesn't really work, cable is near impossible to pull etc.

Given that a healthy water choke works fine, any reason not to convert back?

Thanks, and hope everyone had a good weekend.

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course2kid Jeffrey Johnson
Fountain Valley, CA, USA   USA
1979 MG MGB "Lucy (Lucifer)"
Given that you live in SoCal, to meet smog regulations, if your car was fitted with the water choke when manufactured, then you are supposdd to have it on there. Hiwever, there's a fair chance the smog tech won't notice since they're not likely to know what to look for.

I put a manual choke on mine about 25 years ago, but, I only kept it on there until the next smog check. I figured it was too much hassle to swap it on and off for no significant benefit.

If you decide to put it back on, I'd recommend rebuilding it with new o-rings first. It'a pretty easy job and there is a three part video from John Twist on YouTube that walks you through it (search YouTube for "University Motors Zenith Stromberg" and you should find it.

oleanderjoe Avatar
oleanderjoe Gold Member Joseph Baba
Fresno, CA, USA   USA
RON Never heard of a RED one. The manual choke should pull out with two fingers, really easy. Should work fine. .? Do you still have any of the old choke parts, is the cylinder head the right one for the water choke. Adjustments are critical on the choke mechanism. I would suggest sorting out the manual choke issue.. smileys with beer


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CountBasey Avatar
CountBasey Thomas Basey
Brunswick, OH, USA   USA
1976 MG Midget 1500 "Opus"
Not my opinion below, but one I have heard more times than I care to remember...

I was told over and over again that my ZS carb was junk and that I should swap it out. But my car started and ran so well I didn’t understand why people kept telling me this. Then a much wiser man in my car club informed me that the “water choke” version of my ZS (of which, I have a manual choke) were notorious for issues and constant maintenance, and that is where the ZS carb got most of its bad reputation. I’ve had great luck with my manual choke ZS, and have cleaned and adjusted it with ease. At this point I would never swap it out.

As you have mentioned, a good working water choke should be fine - but getting it working well may be the difficult part. I agree with the prior poster - maybe your manual choke was rigged up or not installed correctly. Got any photos? Not sure why it would be so difficult to move.



Thomas (Count) Basey
Member of Emerald Necklace MG Register - www.mgcleveland.com
________________________________________________________

“With each replacement of parts, my British car slowly becomes Chinese.”

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CountBasey Avatar
CountBasey Thomas Basey
Brunswick, OH, USA   USA
1976 MG Midget 1500 "Opus"
Sorry for second post. I was re-reading your comments and I’m starting to wonder if you meant the DPO TURNED a water choke carb INTO a manual one (originally I thought you meant you were swaping out the whole manual choke carb for a water choke one). If that’s the case, then I might change my view.

Let us know. Again, pictures help!



Thomas (Count) Basey
Member of Emerald Necklace MG Register - www.mgcleveland.com
________________________________________________________

“With each replacement of parts, my British car slowly becomes Chinese.”

tdskip Tom Smith
SoCal, CA, USA   USA
1959 MG MGA
Sorry if I was less than clear.

Will post pictures tomorrow.

The one that is in there is knackered, pull cable is extremely hard to pull.

tdskip Tom Smith
SoCal, CA, USA   USA
1959 MG MGA
Here is the mess that is on it now


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CountBasey Avatar
CountBasey Thomas Basey
Brunswick, OH, USA   USA
1976 MG Midget 1500 "Opus"
Sorry, but I'm going to do something most folks on these forums never do... admit I'm over my head and back away slowly. Hopefully someone has done this before and can lend some help.

That is definitely one of the water choke "conversion kits" - I've seen these before (see image) although I've never seen it in red. As previously stated by another poster, you would have to have all the original water choke guts, and assuming nothing else on the engine was changed, the re-version could be possible. I've never even heard of anyone in our club going backwards so I can't even put out any feelers for information. Might want to see if you can find (on line) the water choke to manual choke conversion kit instructions, and try to follow them backwards to see if everything else in your engine compartment is where it should be.

Everyone always gives their two cents, so here's mine. Ever consider just getting a used manual choke Stromberg? they are usually all over eBay for around $100 or less, and you already have the choke cable installed (I'll shut-up now).

Good luck.



Thomas (Count) Basey
Member of Emerald Necklace MG Register - www.mgcleveland.com
________________________________________________________

“With each replacement of parts, my British car slowly becomes Chinese.”

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calsunshine Paul R
The Valley, CA, USA   USA
1979 MG MGB
I forget who made that conversion but it is actually one of the best ones out there. Essentially all it does is replace the bimetallic spring with a fixed control.

I can not fully see from your picture, but it appears that from pushing and pulling it has crimped the control wire.

Changing back to the water choke will require the following components.

1) Heat Mass - 366--190
2) Insulator - 366-180
3) Retaining ring - 366-195
4) Water cover - 366-200
5) Water hose from choke to radiator hose - Misc Auto Parts Store
6) Water hose from back of head to choke - Misc Auto Parts Store
7) Water outlet from back of head - 470-245
8) Pipe from heater hose to water pump hose with "T" for hose to choke - 363-200 -NLA - Search eBay etc.

Numbers are Moss America

Total cost of all the components is about $150 to $200.

I am near you, PM me if you want me to show you how to fix the manual choke you have, I also have all of the above listed components in very good used condition if you would like any of them.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-04-18 11:28 AM by calsunshine.

Tbird Avatar
Tbird ET Taylor
Land O Sky, NC, USA   USA
Have the older Moss (1985ish) style on mine - this type is a new one to me.

But if you don't mind a guess.....

Appears the octagonal cable clamp has dislodged and is now behind the fixed end of the return spring so that when you pull on the choke the cable it hits the spring and can't go around as it should. (yellow arrow) Possibly all it needs it to move the cable clamp back on the cable a bit (cable may have stretched a little) and tuck that clamp back in the open area. (maybe where the blue arrow is pointing?)

Anyone have some old installation instructions on this unit they could post?

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Tbird Avatar
Tbird ET Taylor
Land O Sky, NC, USA   USA
Eureka!

Found your manual system if you want to try and adjust it.
Moprod MAC 200 kit
Sure enough - looks like the end of the cable at the carb should tuck in the plastic housing not be flopping out.
(see #9 in the instructions)

https://www.howacarworks.com/modifications/converting-an-automatic-choke-to-manual


tdskip Tom Smith
SoCal, CA, USA   USA
1959 MG MGA
Super, thanks for the detective work.

I think I actually have two issues, take a look at the inside. The cam assembly won't rotate at all. Is that what it is supposed to look like inside?


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Tbird Avatar
Tbird ET Taylor
Land O Sky, NC, USA   USA
That looks correct IIRC - been a while since I've worked on mine.

From what I remember when you step on the gas before starting the plastic tab thingy will rotate depending on how much spring pressure is on it from the water type choke spring. The black pin will drop down when the pedal is mashed (geez - my technical terms have been forgotten)

Anyway - now that plastic tab will be (or should be) moved by the manual choke cable.

Check out John Twist's video's on how to take them apart and clean/check.



oleanderjoe Avatar
oleanderjoe Gold Member Joseph Baba
Fresno, CA, USA   USA
TOM: You have TWO systems working against each other. The cam with the TEETH is not used with the Manual Choke Kit like from MOSS. Order one of theirs, install it correctly per the instructions and all will be well. smileys with beer


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calsunshine Paul R
The Valley, CA, USA   USA
1979 MG MGB
The cam can not be turned until the throttle is depressed releasing the arm from the spring loaded pin that is preventing the cam from turning. This is exactly the way it is supposed to work.

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