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Buffers on boot on 1970 Midget?

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phoffman Peter Hoffman
Miller Place, NY, USA   USA
I am replacing the weatherstripping for the boot lid and i got the one from Macgregor.
I also had ordered the buffers from Moss - 282-160 and 380-335.
What is the consensus as if they are needed or not?

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Richard D Avatar
Knoxville, TN, USA   USA
I think I would definitely use them. I think they would help extend the life of your weather stripping for one, … and may even aid in keeping your boot lip and adjacent body panels flush with each other. (?)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2019-02-07 04:25 PM by Richard D.

Kerr Avatar
Kerr Platinum Member Norm Kerr
Ann Arbor, MI, USA   USA
I also ordered a set when restoring my Midget. It had never had them, I didn't know what they were for, or whether I needed them.

In the end, I found they didn't fit (putting them on interfered with the boot lid and weatherstrip), and the panel fit was fine without them, and the original weatherstrip had lasted almost 50 years, so I figured they were only for some unique or unusual purpose (maybe for supporting extremely large loads on a boot rack or something?).

I don't recall if I gave them away, threw them away, or if they are sitting in a box on the shelf.


By the way, before fitting any of your weatherstrips, in fact before paint, it is wise to check the gap between the weatherstrip mounting flange and the face of the mating panel. Each weatherstrip design has a target gap it wants to be put into, and during body work that gap can get all messed up (IIRC, 3/8" is typical for a Midget body weatherstrip). The good thing is that flange is easy to bend in/out, before paint, to correct any variation, and to make sure that in the end the panels will line up flush.

Just a pointer I learned from an old body guy that many, many miss to check before assembly.

N

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Richard D Avatar
Knoxville, TN, USA   USA
Good Day Norm,
You mention 3/8 gap. would that 3/8 gap be from the flange to the panel before the weather stripping is put on? or would it be from the outer edge of the weather stripping to the panel after it's put on?

Sorry for the confusion.

Richard

Chas 906 Avatar
Chas 906 Chuck Peterson
Iron Mountain, MI, USA   USA
1961 MG Midget MkI "Little Red Rider"
Peter, I too recently got a boot seal from McGregor's and the upper and lower buffers with the hardware from Moss. My car came to me with out the buffers like Norm's car. Haven't put the seal or buffers in yet. To friggin cold up here!

phoffman Peter Hoffman
Miller Place, NY, USA   USA
Then I think I will not use them as they just seem like a place for dirt and water to collect.
I have another car that was repainted and does not have them.
I am temporarily installing the weatherstrip as I am aware of the problem of getting the correct fit and alignment before paint.
Thanks for the input.

Kerr Avatar
Kerr Platinum Member Norm Kerr
Ann Arbor, MI, USA   USA
In answer to Richard's question, sorry I wasn't so clear before: the air gap between the inner panel and the bare flange where the weather-strip will be installed to.

This gap is what the weatherstrip will be compressed to when the panel is closed (door, trunk lid, whatever). When in doubt, cut off a short piece of the weatherstrip and try compressing it with your fingers to see where its deformation is the most natural. Measure from the bottom of its attaching groove to the top of the compressed shape to confirm the required gap to create that amount of compression. One thing you can tell for sure from this test is what dimension makes it go to solid rubber x rubber. That amount of compression will always cause trouble, as some over travel is needed for closing, minor tolerance, etc. You definitely want your gap to be larger than that.

Since the weatherstrip is a constant section, it will need that gap to also be constant. Any place where it is too wide will lead to air/water leak, and any place where it is too tight will lead to closing issues and levelness issues.

For the doors one can see the gap directly. For the boot lid, it is necessary to get creative: either get in the boot with a light and measure it, or use some modeling clay and make little towers and then measure what they are crushed to after you have set the boot lid temporarily closed to its correct flush condition. Then, use a heavy pair of pliers, or good body men use a length of steel with a slot cut into it, as a lever arm, and adjust the flange until it is providing an even gap all of the way around the opening. To adjust the boot lid flange you must deform the bottom of the trough, so use a backing dolly to avoid deforming the fender by accident.

Doing this adjustment during the body work stage avoids a ton of trouble during the assembly stage after paint. Sometimes you can still make some adjustment after paint, but its risky.
Doing this can also deal with a host of sins from a new weatherstrip which isn't exactly the same as the original one.

Norm

Red midget Avatar
Red midget Robert G
Honesdale, PA, USA   USA
My '70 has the bumpers, the '74 doesn't. Your choice

Chas 906 Avatar
Chas 906 Chuck Peterson
Iron Mountain, MI, USA   USA
1961 MG Midget MkI "Little Red Rider"
I talked to Martin McGregor prior to ordering the boot seal. He said that the bulb on the seal should compress outward for a correct seal. He said there is a slight offset to the seal and bulb that should be positioned outward. I haven't inspected it yet to determine if the offset exists.

Richard D Avatar
Knoxville, TN, USA   USA
Norm,
Thanks for the clarification. That explains it very well.

66Sprite Avatar
66Sprite David R
Sydney, NSW, Australia   AUS
In reply to # 3887886 by Kerr .... For the boot lid, it is necessary to get creative: either get in the boot with a light and measure it, .....

Norm

Norm, thanks for your post, but getting in the boot! I'd love to see a picture of anyone doing this smiling smiley

Kerr Avatar
Kerr Platinum Member Norm Kerr
Ann Arbor, MI, USA   USA
with the back trim panel out I was able to lean in and see much of the way around (with a strong light), but using modeling clay is much easier

Richard D Avatar
Knoxville, TN, USA   USA
In reply to # 3888130 by 66Sprite
In reply to # 3887886 by Kerr .... For the boot lid, it is necessary to get creative: either get in the boot with a light and measure it, .....

Norm

Norm, thanks for your post, but getting in the boot! I'd love to see a picture of anyone doing this smiling smiley


Joke.....
What's difference between a dog and your girl friend?
Close them both up in the trunk of your midget for 30 minutes,
When you open up the boot lid,... The dog will be glad to see you!! hot smiley

As far as Norms suggestion, with no interior panels, I would think you could work your head and shoulders into the trunk area from the passenger tub of the car.

66Sprite Avatar
66Sprite David R
Sydney, NSW, Australia   AUS
Replying to my own joke, here's the escape from East Germany photo that does the rounds or maybe they were just checking boot seal clearances smileys with beer


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9a8d63fccb54d2d468acaecc3685d9d1.jpg    48.7 KB
9a8d63fccb54d2d468acaecc3685d9d1.jpg

Richard D Avatar
Knoxville, TN, USA   USA
In reply to # 3888156 by 66Sprite Replying to my own joke, here's the escape from East Germany photo that does the rounds or maybe they were just checking boot seal clearances smileys with beer

Add two more people and it would look like me and a few friend sneaking into the drive in movies!! grinning smiley



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2019-02-08 05:24 PM by Richard D.

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