Ecotec for your MGB : MG Engine Swaps Forum : MG Experience Forums : The MG Experience

Ecotec for your MGB #1
bills Bill Spohn W. Vancouver, BC, Canada 1956 MG MGA 1958 MG MGA Twin-Cam 1962 MG MGA MkII Coupe 1965 Jensen CV8 1969 Lamborghini Countach → more	Posted: January 18, 2012 05:32PM Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 9,160

Here's one for sale - complete with turbo, computer, intercooler, trans....$4500

I can put anyone interested in touch.

Bill Spohn www.rhodo.citymax.com/carstuff.html
1958 MGA Twincam (race car), 1962 MGA Deluxe Coupe
1969 MGC roadster, 1957 Jamaican MGA
1965 Jensen CV8, 1971 Jensen Interceptor
1969 Lamborghini Islero S, 1988 Fiero GT turbo
2009 Pontiac Solstice GXP Coupe
West Vancouver BC

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Re: Ecotec for your MGB #2
Dans78MGB Dan Goodwin Shreveport, LA, USA 1978 MG MGB MkIII "Brittnee AKA: Killvette"	Posted: January 18, 2012 07:15PM Registered: 2 years ago Posts: 199

What did it come out of? and what's the power output on these little turbo motors? I'm interested.

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Re: Ecotec for your MGB #3
Jim Stabe San Diego, USA	Posted: January 18, 2012 07:36PM Registered: 4 years ago Posts: 1,240

Bill

Is that anywhere that you could weigh the whole package? Even better would be engine and trans weights separately.

Jim

"If you want me to agree with you then we would both be wrong"

'66 MGB widened 11" with LT1 Chevy and 6 speed, C4 Corvette suspension
Pictures here Part 1 http://forum.britishv8.org/read.php?13,7581
Continued in Part 2 http://forum.britishv8.org/read.php?13,22422
Continued in Part 3 http://forum.britishv8.org/read.php?13,33108

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Re: Ecotec for your MGB #4
Mgbinsc Adam Schanne Hilton Head SC, USA	Posted: January 18, 2012 07:42PM Registered: 2 years ago Posts: 505

Nice little motor, looks cool too....

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Re: Ecotec for your MGB #5
rficalora Rob rficalora Cypress, TX, USA 1976 MG MGB V8 Conversion "MG MUTT"	Posted: January 18, 2012 09:54PM Registered: 7 years ago Posts: 1,680

Bill, how tall is it above the crank center line and where is the sump on the Ecotec? It could be the angle of the pic, but it looks pretty tall.

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Re: Ecotec for your MGB #6
bills Bill Spohn W. Vancouver, BC, Canada 1956 MG MGA 1958 MG MGA Twin-Cam 1962 MG MGA MkII Coupe 1965 Jensen CV8 1969 Lamborghini Countach → more	Posted: January 18, 2012 09:59PM Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 9,160

Its sitting up on blocks so looks taller than it is. I've measured mine and think it would fit an MG without a bulge in the bonnet.

It weights about 75 lbs or more less than the MG engine. and its out of a Solstice. Stock power = 260 BHP/260 TQ, and with a tune, 350 BHP/400TQ is easily doable. Would make an MGB get up and go pretty well.

See this thread for pics:

http://www.mgexperience.net/phorum/read.php?40,1794542,1794542#msg-1794542

Bill Spohn www.rhodo.citymax.com/carstuff.html
1958 MGA Twincam (race car), 1962 MGA Deluxe Coupe
1969 MGC roadster, 1957 Jamaican MGA
1965 Jensen CV8, 1971 Jensen Interceptor
1969 Lamborghini Islero S, 1988 Fiero GT turbo
2009 Pontiac Solstice GXP Coupe
West Vancouver BC

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/18/2012 10:10PM by bills.

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Re: Ecotec for your MGB #7
speedy Michael Terrell Oregon, USA 1975 MG MGB "The Little Engine That Tried" 1995 Jeep Wrangler "Little Engine That Could" 2010 Jeep Commander "People Hauler"	Posted: January 19, 2012 10:02AM Registered: 2 years ago Posts: 685

Once my MG fund grows can you hook me up?
You seem to be the ecotec expert here.
How often do you come across these? For that price range?

1975 MGB
Weber Down draft
Electric ignition
4 speed non O.D.
Soft Suspension
Tight Steering somehow
New Brake lines
New Clutch Master/Slave
SEAFOAM!!!

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Re: Ecotec for your MGB #8
bills Bill Spohn W. Vancouver, BC, Canada 1956 MG MGA 1958 MG MGA Twin-Cam 1962 MG MGA MkII Coupe 1965 Jensen CV8 1969 Lamborghini Countach → more	Posted: January 19, 2012 10:19AM Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 9,160

I own a Solstice so I pay attention to Ecotec engine development and hang out on some of the boards.

That price is better than some because it includes everything you'd need to convert. You see engines alone, or missing intercoolers etc.

The source seems to be people pulling out low mileage engines to stick in an LS V8 conversion, so supply will be uncertain and will depend on economy and disposable income.

If I were starting a project, I'd jump on that one as to assemble the same package from different sources would almost certainly cost more.

For an extra $300 spent on tuning the computer, around 340 BHP is a pretty nice small light package!

Bill Spohn www.rhodo.citymax.com/carstuff.html
1958 MGA Twincam (race car), 1962 MGA Deluxe Coupe
1969 MGC roadster, 1957 Jamaican MGA
1965 Jensen CV8, 1971 Jensen Interceptor
1969 Lamborghini Islero S, 1988 Fiero GT turbo
2009 Pontiac Solstice GXP Coupe
West Vancouver BC

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/19/2012 10:19AM by bills.

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Re: Ecotec for your MGB #9
Duncan Duncan Cowen Vancouver, Canada 1956 MG MGA 1500	Posted: January 19, 2012 05:38PM Registered: 5 years ago Posts: 1,360

In reply to # 1960129 by bills
For an extra $300 spent on tuning the computer, around 340 BHP is a pretty nice small light package!

Let's see... a little math here...

340bhp / 80bhp = 4.25

Oh my, over four times the power of the MGB engine at it's strongest, with less weight. Wow. More than twice the power of my 3.4l conversion. Holy smokes!! These swaps will become popular - and epic!!

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Re: Ecotec for your MGB #10
BillC Bill C Hoover, Alabama, USA 1977 MG MGB	Posted: January 19, 2012 05:43PM Registered: 1 year ago Posts: 135

That transmission weights 126 lb's alone ! The best I could find is that the turbo engine and all that intercooler junk is going to be another 35o lb's that;s over 475 lb's setting there and you will have to reach behind the seat to shift it ! There also will be a lot of other fitment problems. Trans ratios are crap too 3.75,2.26,1.51,1.00,0.73 ; first gear would be worthless unless you spend more money changing the rear end. A 200lb Duratec and a 75lb close ratio T5 makes more since to me.

Bill

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Re: Ecotec for your MGB #11
bills Bill Spohn W. Vancouver, BC, Canada 1956 MG MGA 1958 MG MGA Twin-Cam 1962 MG MGA MkII Coupe 1965 Jensen CV8 1969 Lamborghini Countach → more	Posted: January 19, 2012 05:47PM Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 9,160

Or 5.5 times a RBB single carb engine.

You can get an easy 400 + without going inside the engine. After that you want forged pistons and special rods and can get up into the 5-600 range. The torque often exceed 400 TQ, so is in the small V8 range.

Now you see why I am a fan of these engines. They are the highest output per displacement engine GM has ever made, including all the big block Corvette engines etc., and that is at stock 260 BHP.

The question is whether they are total overkill for an MG (probably). One might be better to go for the LE5 non-turbo version with 177 BHP, but the temptation will always be there for more power.

Come by (in the summer) and I'll give you a ride in a 12 second 1/4 mile machine that weighs 3000 lbs. and has the LNF turbo in it. Imagine what having only 2/3 the weight would do - someone probably has a formula they can dust off to estimate performance on a 2000 lb. version with that engine.

Bill Spohn www.rhodo.citymax.com/carstuff.html
1958 MGA Twincam (race car), 1962 MGA Deluxe Coupe
1969 MGC roadster, 1957 Jamaican MGA
1965 Jensen CV8, 1971 Jensen Interceptor
1969 Lamborghini Islero S, 1988 Fiero GT turbo
2009 Pontiac Solstice GXP Coupe
West Vancouver BC

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Re: Ecotec for your MGB #12
Ogre1 Allan Ogilvie Melbourne Victoria, Australia 1977 MG MGB "Greenb"	Posted: January 19, 2012 05:51PM Registered: 2 years ago Posts: 1,343

Great motor. I have a 2.2 in my astra and they are capable of really big horse numbers in a really small package. I bet that would slot in the MG bay really easily. Only issue might be the sump. The VX220 boys get the 2.2 with a supercharger and hots cams get lots of ponies out these little packages. The turbo models are also interchangable with SAAB turbo 2.0 and 2.2. Heads etc etc. Going to be plenty of scrap saab about the place over the next few years!

They like to rev as well.

Hopefully someone does the conversion and posts some info. Im not really the pioneering type.

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Re: Ecotec for your MGB #13
bills Bill Spohn W. Vancouver, BC, Canada 1956 MG MGA 1958 MG MGA Twin-Cam 1962 MG MGA MkII Coupe 1965 Jensen CV8 1969 Lamborghini Countach → more	Posted: January 19, 2012 06:00PM Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 9,160

In reply to # 1960570 by BillC That transmission weights 126 lb's alone ! The best I could find is that the turbo engine and all that intercooler junk is going to be another 35o lb's that;s over 475 lb's setting there and you will have to reach behind the seat to shift it ! There also will be a lot of other fitment problems. Trans ratios are crap too 3.75,2.26,1.51,1.00,0.73 ; first gear would be worthless unless you spend more money changing the rear end. A 200lb Duratec and a 75lb close ratio T5 makes more since to me.

Bill

Some corrections to that information.

Bill, the transmission weighs only 107 lbs. The shifter is located in about the right place for an MGB, not somewhere behind you. The tranmission ratios are set that way for use with a 3.9 diff but 18" wheels. To use it with a car with 14" or 15" wheels, you would definitely want to go to a longer diff ratio, just as you do when using a T5. Replacing the rear end is a give, unless you have figured out a way to make a stock MGB diff handle 3-400 ft-lbs, right?

A Duratec is indeed a lighter engine, but it isn't a plug and play 290 BHP either.

Bill Spohn www.rhodo.citymax.com/carstuff.html
1958 MGA Twincam (race car), 1962 MGA Deluxe Coupe
1969 MGC roadster, 1957 Jamaican MGA
1965 Jensen CV8, 1971 Jensen Interceptor
1969 Lamborghini Islero S, 1988 Fiero GT turbo
2009 Pontiac Solstice GXP Coupe
West Vancouver BC

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Re: Ecotec for your MGB #14
BillC Bill C Hoover, Alabama, USA 1977 MG MGB	Posted: January 19, 2012 09:37PM Registered: 1 year ago Posts: 135

Well I did make a mistake Bill the transmission pictured above is a 6 speed not a 5 speed but it does weigh what I said. It is a Aisin Ay6 and I don't believe it came out of a Soltice , I would guess that engine and trans is out of a Cadillac CTS and that transmission would put the shifter at about the rear of the seat, just look at it ! Holly cow it looks like it is 34 to 36 inches behind the engine. Yes the Soltice 5 Speed box is 107 lb and it's a piece of crap. You can get bellhousings to put a T5 behind the ecotec I4 and it would be a strong engine in a MGB but it would not fit the MGB very well, so wide you would have to cut into the frame rails. Why use it when the Duratec engine weighs about 2/3 as much and has all the same potential and fits like a glove. Not a bad idea Bill , I just think not worth the trouble. I don't know of anyone putting this engine in an MGB and I bet I never will because you would have to do so much cutting and fitting it just would not be worth it. I don't mean to rain on your parade Bill but I looked into using this engine when I was deciding which engine I wanted to re-power and upgrade an MGB and I found it was not a good candidate. I don't want to argue with you but I just want anyone reading this to measure the Ecotec and realize all the work you will have to do to put one of these into an MGB. Quad 4 Rods has a bellhousing to put a T5 behind it because the Soltice Aisin 5 speed is crap and you better have great welding and fab skills. More power to anyone taking on a Ecotec MGB swap you have more time and patients than I do.

Bill C

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Re: Ecotec for your MGB #15
260mgb Jim Nichols Sequim,WA, USA	Posted: January 19, 2012 09:51PM Registered: 5 years ago Posts: 1,355

Bill C,I have to disagree. I like the Duratec also,Zetec too. Any would be a upgrade over a stock MGB. I like the Ecotec also. The Aisan MA5 in the Solstice/Skye and Colorado/Canyon/Hummer is a fine transmission and used succesfully in Mallet LS conversions behind 400+ HP. Smoother shifting than the T5 and arguably stronger.Based on the R154 Supra which is used behind 900HP twin Turbo drag cars. If you prefer another engine or transmission that is fine, but be a little more open minded and respectful of alternative ideas.

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Re: Ecotec for your MGB #16
BillC Bill C Hoover, Alabama, USA 1977 MG MGB	Posted: January 19, 2012 11:09PM Registered: 1 year ago Posts: 135

In reply to # 1960782 by 260mgb Bill C,I have to disagree. I like the Duratec also,Zetec too. Any would be a upgrade over a stock MGB. I like the Ecotec also. The Aisan MA5 in the Solstice/Skye and Colorado/Canyon/Hummer is a fine transmission and used succesfully in Mallet LS conversions behind 400+ HP. Smoother shifting than the T5 and arguably stronger.Based on the R154 Supra which is used behind 900HP twin Turbo drag cars. If you prefer another engine or transmission that is fine, but be a little more open minded and respectful of alternative ideas.

I'm sorry Jim that I have a problem with the "Aisin" MA5 tranny but here it is :
(1) Crummy gear ratios
(2) Leak concern- input seal, output rear extension seal
(3) Noise concerns - Whine, Rattle or Growl
(4) Shift concerns - 4th gear, 5th gear or Shift lever issues
Yes it is said to be "as strong as the WC T5" GM quote, but it has problems as GM has found out, I am well connected with GM and I know things.
Yes it is a pretty cool engine and strong but I wouldn't try to put a 426 Hemi in an MGB either , it is too tall and too wide for the MGB , I like the engine , it's just not good for the MGB because of all the work that would have to be done. I would think all opinions would be welcome here. Oh I'm plenty open minded considering I was at one time thinking of putting a Ecotec in an MGB long before this post and I am voicing the concerns I had with the swap. And as far as being respectful believe me you will have my deep respect if you can successfully put one of these in an MGB. I would think anyone would want to hear from someone who spent a good bit of time looking into doing this as I did ! If my opinions bother you well I'm sorry.

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Re: Ecotec for your MGB #17
bills Bill Spohn W. Vancouver, BC, Canada 1956 MG MGA 1958 MG MGA Twin-Cam 1962 MG MGA MkII Coupe 1965 Jensen CV8 1969 Lamborghini Countach → more	Posted: January 20, 2012 12:52AM Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 9,160

The Aisan AR5 is a decent tranmission with far higher torque capacity than the T5. Not sure why you have conceived a hate for it, but so be it. Suggest you drive one before condemning it. I drive it all the time and it is quite decent. It also holds up in LS3 conversions.

Bill Spohn www.rhodo.citymax.com/carstuff.html
1958 MGA Twincam (race car), 1962 MGA Deluxe Coupe
1969 MGC roadster, 1957 Jamaican MGA
1965 Jensen CV8, 1971 Jensen Interceptor
1969 Lamborghini Islero S, 1988 Fiero GT turbo
2009 Pontiac Solstice GXP Coupe
West Vancouver BC

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Re: Ecotec for your MGB #18
BillC Bill C Hoover, Alabama, USA 1977 MG MGB	Posted: January 20, 2012 05:43AM Registered: 1 year ago Posts: 135

Bill S,

Please I don't hate anything, let's not throw the hate word around. I have a friend that worked for GM all through the development of the Soltice. He knows I like sports cars and he ask me what I thought of the Soltice. I told him it was okay BUT !
They took the engine from a Cobalt and the transmission from a PICKUP TRUCK yes it is stout its from a PICKUP TRUCK. The gearing is all wrong for the Soltice, at highway speeds you have to down shift to pass, very annoying, otherwise it falls flat on it's face. The car was too heavy needs to lose 500 lb's , handles okay but no feel for the road. He didn't like what I was telling him but he knew I was right. It's a boulevard cruiser not a real sports car, rather have a Miata it's a billion times more fun to drive if I were going to buy a todays sports car. True I never drove the turbo model, just what it needed more weight bolted on to it !
If someone decides they have to put the Ecotec in a B put a Ford Racing #397-M-7003-Z T5 2.95 first gear for stock engine or a Richmond Gear 2.89 first gear if you are going to put the power to it, let someone put the Aisin AR5 back in a pickup truck.

Bill C

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Re: Ecotec for your MGB #19
bills Bill Spohn W. Vancouver, BC, Canada 1956 MG MGA 1958 MG MGA Twin-Cam 1962 MG MGA MkII Coupe 1965 Jensen CV8 1969 Lamborghini Countach → more	Posted: January 20, 2012 08:23AM Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 9,160

I agree that, like the T5, the first gear is too low on the AR5. BTW, you don't need the Ford Racing T5 to get better gearing. The one I use in the Jamaican is out oa V8 car and has the 2.95 first gear (and cost a fraction of the price the Ford version does).

If you intend to tune an LNF engine, though, you'll quickly exceed the torque capacity of the World Class T5 box, and anything other than the AR5 gets expensive (you can use any of the GM boxes with the late bolt pattern, including the heavy duty, and just plain heavy weight Cadillac options).

BTW, the LNF engine doesn't fall on its face when you shift. It has peak torque from 2500 through 5000 RPM. You might be right about the NA version, I don't recall.

Bill Spohn www.rhodo.citymax.com/carstuff.html
1958 MGA Twincam (race car), 1962 MGA Deluxe Coupe
1969 MGC roadster, 1957 Jamaican MGA
1965 Jensen CV8, 1971 Jensen Interceptor
1969 Lamborghini Islero S, 1988 Fiero GT turbo
2009 Pontiac Solstice GXP Coupe
West Vancouver BC

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/20/2012 11:26AM by bills.

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Re: Ecotec for your MGB #20
BillC Bill C Hoover, Alabama, USA 1977 MG MGB	Posted: January 20, 2012 11:02AM Registered: 1 year ago Posts: 135

Nothing like a nice friendly discussion Bill , bottom line is although a damn fine engine the dimensions of the Ecotec engine just do not lend itself to fitting in the MGB very well. I am of the opinion that anything over 300hp in an MGB can't be used unless you are building a drag car with big slicks. I am running 205/50-15 Dunlop Direzza Sport Z1 Star Spec tires and I think they will not be able to hold all that I throw at them with the Duratec 170hp engine tuned to 200+ hp with twin webers ran through the heavy duty T5 tranny and the stock rear with posi. My car is very light , striped to 1900 and I think I will lose some more weight with the engine swap. I believe it will be a hand full , very fast and a delight to drive. Not much since to have more power than you could ever use to me, just makes the car more difficult to drive and dangerous. If I need a little more I will change the cams and push it to 300hp don't think I will go past that because then you have to change the drive line and things get expensive. If someone does put a Ecotec in a B they have my respect !

Bill C

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