What to look out for when shopping for a T5? : MG Engine Swaps Forum : MG Experience Forums : The MG Experience

What to look out for when shopping for a T5? #1
MG-Maxx Charles Waugh Hamden, Ct, USA 1979 MG MGB MkIII "Rumpelstiltskin"	Posted: November 02, 2011 12:53PM Registered: 2 years ago Posts: 336

Going to look at a T5 from a 89 Mustang. Will be have the handy dandy T5 cross reference sheet to make sure it has the right gears, but what else should I be looking at?

The he says that the trans is from a 89 Mustang that he blew the motor in... Second sign that has my attention that the T5 might be a little rough. The first is that it is out of a Mustang... He does have a 95 now, so he might know what he is talking about, but not if it is the truth.

Is there any signs or areas to look at. I know to check the seals but what elze.

A little background in my conversion. I will be using BCC 3500 E-kit, with a 04 Malibu 3500 (>4,000mi) and a Ford T5.

The price is something not to pass up on (too good?) it is either this or buying a new one. Saving the $1000 could be used elsewhere in the conversion. Since the motor will be practically new, if budget was bigger the new T% would be the way to go, but then again, I would not be using the economy kit from BCC.......

Thanks for any hints.

Chuck
Hamden, CT

79 MGB - Rumpelstiltskin
Just awakened after a 10 year slumber.
Weber 32/36 DGV, a Stuck 45d Dizzy (stuck at 10 BTDC), Bad Vacuum advance disconnected n plugged. (refer to stuck dizzy) , Peco Exhast.

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Re: What to look out for when shopping for a T5? #2
garylum Gary Lum Nor Cal, USA	Posted: November 02, 2011 01:13PM Registered: 1 year ago Posts: 187

Perfect timing, I was just about to search for something similar. I wanted to find out if a 96 camaro t5 would work for my 3.4l swap with an s10 bell. I seem to recall reading that the T5's changed to the ford bolt holes (instead of the corporate pattern) at some point in the early 90's

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Re: What to look out for when shopping for a T5? #3
MG-Maxx Charles Waugh Hamden, Ct, USA 1979 MG MGB MkIII "Rumpelstiltskin"	Posted: November 02, 2011 01:35PM Registered: 2 years ago Posts: 336

I am looking for a Ford T5 due to the Kit I am using from BCC. Their kit comes set up to use the Ford tranny but a 94-95 2.2l Bellhousing.

This link might give you some information on the BCC kits. BMC and CCE also sell kits. Each are come set up for a certain Tranny/Bell combo but can be switched around depending on your set up.

http://britishcarconversions.com/faqs-mainmenu-25/63-lx9-procedure

Here is the link to the t5 ID tag referencehttp://www.britishv8.org/Articles/Borg-Warner-T5-ID-Tags.htm

Chuck
Hamden, CT

79 MGB - Rumpelstiltskin
Just awakened after a 10 year slumber.
Weber 32/36 DGV, a Stuck 45d Dizzy (stuck at 10 BTDC), Bad Vacuum advance disconnected n plugged. (refer to stuck dizzy) , Peco Exhast.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/02/2011 01:42PM by MG-Maxx.

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Re: What to look out for when shopping for a T5? #4
smelfi Steve Melfi Alexandria Ohio, USA 1977 MG MGB	Posted: November 03, 2011 09:47AM Registered: 3 years ago Posts: 51

Two things I'd check are the lateral play of the input and output shafts, and any excess wear on the front bearing housing caused by the throw out bearing.

My T5 came out of my doner car, a built up 88 302 Thunderbird which is more or less the same as an 88 Mustang. I knew the transmission would need a rebuid when I test drove the Thunderbird - the 1st to 2nd and 2nd to 3rd syncros were marginal. What I found when I pulled it out was a lot of lateral play in the input and output shafts. Both can be moved up and down a good 1/4 of an inch. The front bearing housing (the housing the input shaft sticks out of) has excess wear on it where the throw out bearing slides back a forth on it.
Rebuild kits cost around $250. There are a bunch of vendors selling them and from the variuos forums I've visited two vendors seem to stand out as honest, reliable, and cutomer centric - D&D performance and Hanlon Motorsports.

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Re: What to look out for when shopping for a T5? #5
MG-Maxx Charles Waugh Hamden, Ct, USA 1979 MG MGB MkIII "Rumpelstiltskin"	Posted: November 03, 2011 05:47PM Registered: 2 years ago Posts: 336

Had him read off the tag to me but does not sound like the correct tag. It has :
003-A 10812 E0803. It has WC on the case and is a Borg Warner.

From the list that I have seen the tag should have a 1352 dash a three digit number which tells you the what car/gears.

Going this weekend to look. Have pics that will show me if it is a WC but need to know the gearing... He is asking $500 so price is right, which of coarse makes me leery. But worth a 20 minute ride.

Chuck
Hamden, CT

79 MGB - Rumpelstiltskin
Just awakened after a 10 year slumber.
Weber 32/36 DGV, a Stuck 45d Dizzy (stuck at 10 BTDC), Bad Vacuum advance disconnected n plugged. (refer to stuck dizzy) , Peco Exhast.

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Re: What to look out for when shopping for a T5? #6
ex-tyke Graham Creswick Chatham, Ontario, Canada 1976 MG MGB	Posted: November 03, 2011 07:00PM Registered: 5 years ago Posts: 777

The T5 in my conversion also came out of a '89 Stang - ID # 1352-169.
The front bearing retainer is aluminum and WILL show wear from the TOB - fortunately, there are steel equivalents that wear better. eg on ebay
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Fox-Mustang-Capri-5-0L-T-5-Front-Bearing-Retainer-/380382172611?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr&hash=item58908b55c3
Can't remember if the speedo sender is mechanical or electronic but try to have one included in the purchase price......and ensure there is a reverse switch included.

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Re: What to look out for when shopping for a T5? #7
scott68B Scott Costanzo Ohio, USA 1968 MG MGB	Posted: November 04, 2011 09:43AM Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 445

Just went through this myself. It's really a crap shoot unless you can try it out first. I looked at a lot of junk, mostly 4 cylinder transmissions that were being passed off as coming from an 8 cylinder car. I didn't want to put a lot of money into a supposedly rebuilt one either. I wouldn't buy one that didn't have a tag on it although that's no guarantee either. I would also make sure it goes into into every gear.

I decided to try to find a rebuildable unit. I ended up with a 1352-169 that is supposed to have a bad 3-4 syncro. It doesn't look like it has ever been opened up and the tag is intact. I'm going to start disassembling it this weekend so I should know a lot more then. Even if it's junk I only have $100 in it.

-- Scott

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Re: What to look out for when shopping for a T5? #8
Ryan Reis Beatrice, NE, USA 1968 MG MGB	Posted: November 04, 2011 10:34AM Registered: 12 years ago Posts: 4,375

Seems like I spew out this same post every time this topic comes up, but check out the 1999-2004 v6 mustang t5. They are plentiful in yards and cheaper because of the v6 label (think I paid $250 for mine with less than 100k), but it is essentially the same trans as the 94-95 5.0 cars. Stronger gears, v8 gearing (3.35 1st) and can be bought with low miles. The catch is that it has the longer input shaft and no output for a cable speedo. I replaced the input shaft and bearing retainer with parts from Astro transmissions (I think <$200 and about an hour to install) and am planning to run an electronic speedo. It's just a better transmission than the worn out abused junk that you get from the 5.0 crowd.

Quote from Factory Five forum: The 99-2004 Mustang V6 T5 (tag 1352-260) is identical to a 94/95 5.0 GT T5 except the tail housing and main shaft are made for the electronic speedometer sending unit. Gears 1-5 and input shaft match the 94/95 GT. This T5 has the 0.68 fifth gear that has been the GT standard throughout the years. The crossmember goes a little further back on this tail housing than the previous years of T5s if you keep this housing. I understand that this electronic Speedometer sending unit works fine with the Autometer speedometers.

http://www.ffcars.com/forums/17-factory-five-roadsters/244421-t5-tranny-recommendations.html

Ryan Reis
Beatrice,NE

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Re: What to look out for when shopping for a T5? #9
bills Bill Spohn W. Vancouver, BC, Canada 1956 MG MGA 1958 MG MGA Twin-Cam 1962 MG MGA MkII Coupe 1965 Jensen CV8 1969 Lamborghini Countach → more	Posted: November 04, 2011 11:11AM Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 9,135

Good info, Ryan - I had never bothered looking at the later trans options!

Using a Mustang allows you a level as opposed to slanted rear trans mount, which may be a benefit, although I had no problem mounting the Camaro slanted version.

If you keep a stock diff the V8 trans are much better. The 4 cylinder S10 versions have absurdely low first gears.

I'd suggest printing out teh handy chart at to carry on the hunt so you know what you are getting.

I would always shoot for one with the 'U' gear ratios, and don't worry if it has the really long legged .63 5th - that's what I have and it makes a really nice crusing gear.

Bill Spohn www.rhodo.citymax.com/carstuff.html
1958 MGA Twincam (race car), 1962 MGA Deluxe Coupe
1969 MGC roadster, 1957 Jamaican MGA
1965 Jensen CV8, 1971 Jensen Interceptor
1969 Lamborghini Islero S, 1988 Fiero GT turbo
2009 Pontiac Solstice GXP Coupe
West Vancouver BC

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Re: What to look out for when shopping for a T5? #10
ex-tyke Graham Creswick Chatham, Ontario, Canada 1976 MG MGB	Posted: November 04, 2011 11:28AM Registered: 5 years ago Posts: 777

Post deleted - wrong thread.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/04/2011 11:48AM by ex-tyke.

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Re: What to look out for when shopping for a T5? #11
MG-Maxx Charles Waugh Hamden, Ct, USA 1979 MG MGB MkIII "Rumpelstiltskin"	Posted: November 05, 2011 09:01AM Registered: 2 years ago Posts: 336

Went to look at the T5 last night. The guy said it had about 60k miles on it. I think it has more or was abused as most are. The input shaft had enough play in it to touch the collar on all sides.

This one was a ($500)
1352-200 - Ford 1989 SVO Mustang WC (After Market)U 2.76 2.95 1.94 1.34 1.00 0.63

He then showed me one that was nice no real movement on either shaft. He wanted $800 for this one

1352-169 Ford 1986 1/2 Mustang/Capri 5.30 V8 WC V 3.15 3.35 1.93 1.29 1.00 0.68

This one appeared to be in good condition and would not need to be rebuilt.

He said he was about to remove another one from his wife's mustang is suppose to have the same tranny as the first one 1352-200. The reason for replacing it is that the gearing is too low for his wife's liking? Maybe it is the same as the second one.

Another question is which T5 list is correct. I have used the one on the BritishV8 site for the above numbers but another list shows these results:

200 Motorsport 79-83 Mustang 5 305 2.95 1.94 1.34 1 0.63
169 Ford 86.5-89 Mustang/Capri 5 265 3.35 1.93 1.29 1 0.68

The 200 version is suppose to rated for 300 ftlbs while the 169 version is only 265 ftlbs. The 3500 motor which I am installing is rated at 220 ftlbs so if I build it up much more then that, need to go with the first tranny.

If I take the first one which appears to be the gearing/torque that is best, but another $250 for a rebuild kit +... I have never rebuilt a manual tranny before. I started a rebuild years ago on a C4 for my 68 mustang, but had to have someone else to finish it up due to not have all the correct tools.

The alternative is to just go with Jegs/Summit and buy a new one. That would run me close to $1,500 with shipping. The motor I am putting in only have 4k miles so putting in a new tranny is interesting to me but not my budget. Saving the $700 difference would pay for the new gas tank...

Chuck
Hamden, CT

79 MGB - Rumpelstiltskin
Just awakened after a 10 year slumber.
Weber 32/36 DGV, a Stuck 45d Dizzy (stuck at 10 BTDC), Bad Vacuum advance disconnected n plugged. (refer to stuck dizzy) , Peco Exhast.

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Re: What to look out for when shopping for a T5? #12
bills Bill Spohn W. Vancouver, BC, Canada 1956 MG MGA 1958 MG MGA Twin-Cam 1962 MG MGA MkII Coupe 1965 Jensen CV8 1969 Lamborghini Countach → more	Posted: November 05, 2011 10:14AM Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 9,135

Charles, it is my limited experience that the Mustang T5s seem to get harder use than the GM applications (maybe the Chev 305 was such a dog that no one bothered hammering them?). Consider that as an alternate source - I don't think that the canted mouting would bother you although the shifter would be a little closer to your leg (worked for me).

In the large picture, I'd go for the one with the best ratios and get it rebuilt - then you know what you have and it will last as long as you own the car. The extra $3-400 spent on the rebuild is small potatoes over the life of your car. Buy the rebuild kit and find a mechanic that wants to work for cash or beer on his own time, maybe.

Bill Spohn www.rhodo.citymax.com/carstuff.html
1958 MGA Twincam (race car), 1962 MGA Deluxe Coupe
1969 MGC roadster, 1957 Jamaican MGA
1965 Jensen CV8, 1971 Jensen Interceptor
1969 Lamborghini Islero S, 1988 Fiero GT turbo
2009 Pontiac Solstice GXP Coupe
West Vancouver BC

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Re: What to look out for when shopping for a T5? #13
ex-tyke Graham Creswick Chatham, Ontario, Canada 1976 MG MGB	Posted: November 05, 2011 02:28PM Registered: 5 years ago Posts: 777

Quote: The 3500 motor which I am installing is rated at 220 ftlbs so if I build it up much more then that, need to go with the first tranny

...don't get hung up on the 265ft-lb rating - it's going in a light car that will spin tires before breaking any xsmn component. I will say, however, that the 2.95 first on the 'Z' xsmn is a better choice that the 3.35 ratio.
I've got the same somewhat abused 265ft-lb xsmn behind my lukewarm 302....it's just fine!

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Re: What to look out for when shopping for a T5? #14
cncguy Marc Traylor Ohio, USA	Posted: November 05, 2011 07:45PM Registered: 6 years ago Posts: 318

As Graham said the 265 ft/lb unit will work fine and the 2.95 first gear is much better with the stock rear axle. Should you decide to buy a new Ford Motorsports transmission, Roush-Yates sells them for the same price as Summit but has lower shipping charges.

Marc

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Re: What to look out for when shopping for a T5? #15
BillC Bill C Hoover, Alabama, USA 1977 MG MGB	Posted: November 06, 2011 08:24AM Registered: 1 year ago Posts: 133

What to look out for .... This !
1295.99 at Jegs
Die-cast aluminum housings reduce weight
Advanced synchronizers, bearings, and bearing retainer
Tapered roller bearings on shafts minimize noise and wear
Powdered steel core blocker rings & engineered friction materials
Patented strut-type design for durability
Internal, single-rail shift system
Requires 5.62 pints of fluid
1st to 4th gear needle bearings improve high-speed performance and lessen shift effort
5th gear overdrive provides extended ratio coverage
Sliding idler Reverse for simplicity and reliability
Gear Ratios: 1st 2.95, 2nd 1.94, 3rd 1.34, 4th 1.00, 5th .63, Reverse 2.76

Well worth the money IMO !
Bill

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Re: What to look out for when shopping for a T5? #16
MG-Maxx Charles Waugh Hamden, Ct, USA 1979 MG MGB MkIII "Rumpelstiltskin"	Posted: November 06, 2011 09:09AM Registered: 2 years ago Posts: 336

I can't disagree with you Bill, but my budget keeps making a moaning noise when I put that in the spreadsheet.... yawning smiley

Especially when compared to the free T5 from a 94 Camaro V6. It should have Z gearing, not really good with the stock rear. I do plan on replacing the rear, but that is phase 2 (yr 2).

Humm... If I take that $1500 (including shipping) and put it toward the rear end now.... Wonder if I can get a rear end shortened and set up for the MG for that much..

I kinda wish there were fewer options.... devil smiley

Would make life simpler...or at least the decision making...

Chuck
Hamden, CT

79 MGB - Rumpelstiltskin
Just awakened after a 10 year slumber.
Weber 32/36 DGV, a Stuck 45d Dizzy (stuck at 10 BTDC), Bad Vacuum advance disconnected n plugged. (refer to stuck dizzy) , Peco Exhast.

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Re: What to look out for when shopping for a T5? #17
BillC Bill C Hoover, Alabama, USA 1977 MG MGB	Posted: November 06, 2011 06:10PM Registered: 1 year ago Posts: 133

I get this a lot! I see guys get a rusty MGB and put 2000 in replacement parts and about 4000 worth of their time fixing it. Then they spend gobs of money in a V8 and then they put a worn out wide ratio T5 in the car that will break then they have to find and replace with another worn out wide ratio. You know them, the guys I fly by in my close ratio smooth shifting T5. To me it was smarter to find a rust free MGB fix it up quicker , put great parts in it and have a great dependable car. But that's just me.
Bill

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Re: What to look out for when shopping for a T5? #18
djdavies David D Ca, USA 1973 MG MGB	Posted: May 03, 2012 10:04PM Registered: 3 years ago Posts: 559

In reply to # 1896778 by Ryan Reis The catch is that it has the longer input shaft and no output for a cable speedo. I replaced the input shaft and bearing retainer with parts from Astro transmissions (I think <$200 and about an hour to install) and am planning to run an electronic speedo. It's just a better transmission than the worn out abused junk that you get from the 5.0 crowd.

Hope this follow up doesn't find this post too old, but my question is about input shaft compatibility. I have a 135-238 (94-95 Mustang) T5-WC, and would like to just buy and swap the input shaft. What years would I be looking for?

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Re: What to look out for when shopping for a T5? #19
kerbau53 Geoff Morton Naples, Florida, USA 1978 MG MGB V8 Conversion "The Wreck"	Posted: May 03, 2012 11:09PM Registered: 2 years ago Posts: 1,056

In reply to a post by Bill C. To me it was smarter to find a rust free MGB fix it up quicker , put great parts in it and have a great dependable car. But that's just me.

X2++

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Re: What to look out for when shopping for a T5? #20
Ryan Reis Beatrice, NE, USA 1968 MG MGB	Posted: May 04, 2012 09:01AM Registered: 12 years ago Posts: 4,375

David, what swap are you doing? The gm 60 degree v6? If so I think you need the 87-93 v8 mustang input shaft. Like I said, I bought a new one but there's probably used ones available on ebay. You should definitely consider replacing the bearing retainer with a steel one if it doesn't already have one. Regardless, if you're doing the v6 swap check with Bill Guzman to make sure you're getting the correct input shaft length and spline.

Ryan Reis
Beatrice,NE

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