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rust attack progress pics!

Posted by pants007

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Re: rust attack progress pics! #101
purpleGT Bud Osbourne Pittsburgh, PA., USA 1974 MG MGB GT "The Grape" 1977 MG MGB	Posted: March 27, 2012 01:26PM Registered: 5 years ago Posts: 2,209

Finally got the opportunity to take some photos of my cockpit bracing in action. THe car it's in, right now, is turned upside-down, but I don't think that will matter, in the photos.
BTW, it was good that I did finally get an excuse to check in on this project, as my friend was in danger of passing the point of no return, in a couple of locations.
Specifically, in his new-found enthusiasm to make progress on this VERY restorable '74 Midget, he has cut out a lot more than I would have recommended. It is important that certain original, even though too rusty to save pieces be left in place, for use as referrence points for the new panels to be installed. Also, it's not a good idea to remove BOTH sills at the same time, although, in this case, the bracing will hold everything in place.
A good "rule of thumb" is that you cut out only what you need to remove, in order to facilitate work on the aparticular area of the unibody that you are working on. All of the rusted, or suspect panels should, of course, be cleaned-up enough to allow an accurate assessment of their condition, but it's best to leave original panels in place, until it's time to replace them with new steel.

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Re: rust attack progress pics! #102
pants007 stevyn knox isle of man, United Kingdom	Posted: March 27, 2012 02:16PM Registered: 1 year ago Posts: 620

bud you have made me go cross-eyed! do you know how hard it is to stand on your head while taking notes! so do you bolt all fixing pieces on then weld the braces in? do i add anything as i'll be taking the inner arch, forward/outer toe boards and maybe sill off? where do i start? i'll need a new forward toe board in before i can put new arch inplace, but i'll need sill off to extract the side board! think my head is about to explode!

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Re: rust attack progress pics! #103
NOHOME Peter Plouf London, Canada 1961 Austin-Healey Sprite Bugeye "Lil" 1967 MG MGB GT "Maggie (GT From Hell)"	Posted: March 27, 2012 02:47PM Registered: 6 years ago Posts: 11,898

Thats some brace! eye popping smiley

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Re: rust attack progress pics! #104
purpleGT Bud Osbourne Pittsburgh, PA., USA 1974 MG MGB GT "The Grape" 1977 MG MGB	Posted: March 27, 2012 04:09PM Registered: 5 years ago Posts: 2,209

In reply to # 2024043 by pants007 bud you have made me go cross-eyed! do you know how hard it is to stand on your head while taking notes! so do you bolt all fixing pieces on then weld the braces in? do i add anything as i'll be taking the inner arch, forward/outer toe boards and maybe sill off? where do i start? i'll need a new forward toe board in before i can put new arch inplace, but i'll need sill off to extract the side board! think my head is about to explode!

Yes, bolt the mounting pieces in, first, then custom cut & weld the square tubing to suit.
Sill off to extract side board? Do you mean the side of the footwell?

I'll review the photos you've posted and let you know how I think I would do it. Right now, I have to get ready to leave for a meeting. I'll check it out later this evening or in the morning.

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Re: rust attack progress pics! #105
purpleGT Bud Osbourne Pittsburgh, PA., USA 1974 MG MGB GT "The Grape" 1977 MG MGB	Posted: March 27, 2012 04:16PM Registered: 5 years ago Posts: 2,209

In reply to # 2024061 by NOHOME Thats some brace! eye popping smiley

And it's good that it is. My friend, in addition to cutting BOTH (left & right) sills out at the same time, is supporting the poor thing on his rotisserie by it's front dumb irons (bumper mounts)and the rear bumper mounts (!!!). He also doesn't have the diagonal bracing bolted in, to protect against twisting. I thought I heard the poor thing wimpering from the stress, once or twice, but it seems to be holding up pretty well.

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Re: rust attack progress pics! #106
pants007 stevyn knox isle of man, United Kingdom	Posted: March 27, 2012 04:43PM Registered: 1 year ago Posts: 620

yeah the outer footwell! its sandwiched between my inner and outer sill. at least you have one thing to be thankfull for you wont need to guide me through the left hand side when the time comes! oh and by the way thats where i would have fixed the rotisserie! i think im the dumb iron! confused smiley

im off to bed 5am start tomorrow!

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Re: rust attack progress pics! #107
pants007 stevyn knox isle of man, United Kingdom	Posted: April 03, 2012 10:11AM Registered: 1 year ago Posts: 620

hey guys! well im still waiting to get the steel for my bracing, so doing some other jobs.

as you can see in the pics i've taken the left hand bead off the rear wing and ground out the rust, im not putting beading back on so what should i do? fill with weld and grind smooth or fill it with something?

what are all those small dints running along the inside edge of the rear wing? and what could have caused them?

and last of all the hole you can see was full of bondo, i have cut the jagged edges off; whats the best repair for this?

thanks guys..

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Re: rust attack progress pics! #108
purpleGT Bud Osbourne Pittsburgh, PA., USA 1974 MG MGB GT "The Grape" 1977 MG MGB	Posted: April 03, 2012 04:24PM Registered: 5 years ago Posts: 2,209

Stevyn,
Since you are not replacing the beading (which would be a BEAR of a job), about the only long-term solution will be to fillet weld the seam. This SHOULD be a very long, tedious welding process, to avoid warping she sh_t out of the adjacent metal.
The small dents, on top of the rear fender, appear to be the result of some nit-wit pecking away at it with a body hammer of some sort and for a reason only a nit-wit could rationalize.
The hole, in the second picture, is one that I would weld shut. Again, a tedious, time consuming welding process to bridge the gap (lots of pulsing to form several "bridges" winking smiley

without getting things too warm.

Be sure to practice A LOT on some scrap metal, before attacking the Midget with the MIG as the potential for creating some real ugliness is very significant, here.

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Re: rust attack progress pics! #109
NOHOME Peter Plouf London, Canada 1961 Austin-Healey Sprite Bugeye "Lil" 1967 MG MGB GT "Maggie (GT From Hell)"	Posted: April 03, 2012 06:07PM Registered: 6 years ago Posts: 11,898

I am going to lose sleep over what the heck was going on with the hammer marks! The ONLY thing that makes sense is that the person started doing mud work and was finding high spots and just bashing them in as they went until the surface could be filled to shape. Was there a lot of filler in that area?

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Re: rust attack progress pics! #110
purpleGT Bud Osbourne Pittsburgh, PA., USA 1974 MG MGB GT "The Grape" 1977 MG MGB	Posted: April 03, 2012 08:25PM Registered: 5 years ago Posts: 2,209

In reply to # 2030630 by NOHOME I am going to lose sleep over what the heck was going on with the hammer marks! The ONLY thing that makes sense is that the person started doing mud work and was finding high spots and just bashing them in as they went until the surface could be filled to shape. Was there a lot of filler in that area?

Peter, there are some things which are better left alone. Trying to figure a rational explanation for those hammer marks certainly falls into that category. winking smiley

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Re: rust attack progress pics! #111
pants007 stevyn knox isle of man, United Kingdom	Posted: April 04, 2012 03:18AM Registered: 1 year ago Posts: 620

hey peter not sure about how much filler was in there as it was sand blasted! but as the doors and wings were made of filler i assume the po just loved that stuff? should i just fill the dints? or pull them out? we have an electric weld puller at work.

Im working around the car at the moment welding small holes and pin holes, also sanding the sandblasted surface! is it ok just to acid etch prime (rattle can) the different sections as i go? does it keep moisture out? or do i need to get epoxy on as soon as possible? i going to be cutting so much off i really dont want to waste paint.

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Re: rust attack progress pics! #112
NOHOME Peter Plouf London, Canada 1961 Austin-Healey Sprite Bugeye "Lil" 1967 MG MGB GT "Maggie (GT From Hell)"	Posted: April 04, 2012 06:17AM Registered: 6 years ago Posts: 11,898

Stevyn:

We all struggle with what to do with bare metal while we do the rust work. Regular primer is really designed such that it works against us. It looks like it is doing the job, but actually pulls moisture from the air and makes things worse.

Epoxy is the answer, but not really practical.

I have in the past used the spray can acid etch primers figuring they may be better than the regular; no real reason to validate thought.

I have started just coating the repair or repair in waiting with brush-on rustoleum paint; it is cheap, meant to keep off oxidation and will be sanded off anyways.

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Re: rust attack progress pics! #113
pants007 stevyn knox isle of man, United Kingdom	Posted: April 04, 2012 12:34PM Registered: 1 year ago Posts: 620

hey peter! before i etch primed i used a a product called 'phos klean B' from the the rust.co.uk webpage. i had a go using it on my left hand door which i left for about 4/5 weeks; rubbed it on and when ready to paint panel wipe off. no rust at all! they also do a rust converter that i used on the inside of the door (i'll post pics later) worked great. and am also going to use there epoxy mastic on the underside and inside and custom epoxy on outside and panels. could you just phosphoric acid the whole car?

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Re: rust attack progress pics! #114
pants007 stevyn knox isle of man, United Kingdom	Posted: April 10, 2012 10:09AM Registered: 1 year ago Posts: 620

well i still aint started any major welding but been pottering about painting parts and trying out some new products i bought!

so i started to clean up the trunk area right and left where it looks like the po has welding in 2x outer trunk floor sections.

this whole car was covered in a hard tar like stuff that sand blasting wouldn't remove (pic 1) he didn't weld them flush but they look solid so will leave in i think.

pic 2 cleaned up and panel wiped ready for rust.co.uk rust converter and water proofer. it goes on white pic3 and turns black when cured. they also recommend it for injecting into chassis frames and other sections before waxoyl.

pic 4 cured and black; now i does say say use on rust but i contacted them and they said it works on clean metal and just need a light sand before epoxy. also will be good left un-painted for months!

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Re: rust attack progress pics! #115
pants007 stevyn knox isle of man, United Kingdom	Posted: April 10, 2012 10:11AM Registered: 1 year ago Posts: 620

pic 3 and 4

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Re: rust attack progress pics! #116
MaddogSprite3 jeff rohrbach raleigh nc, USA	Posted: April 16, 2012 09:44AM Registered: 4 years ago Posts: 57

Stevyn, how goes it with your project? Hope all is well. You've got a real chore on your hands with this one. If it wasn't for the Big Sink in between us, I'd love to give you a hand. As for swapping shells, i think I'll stick with mine! Best of luck, keep us posted.

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Re: rust attack progress pics! #117
pants007 stevyn knox isle of man, United Kingdom	Posted: April 16, 2012 09:59AM Registered: 1 year ago Posts: 620

hey jeff! slow progress at the moment, an hour here and there! everything seems to take forever to do! i've just reinstalled the bolts on my diff casing before shot blasting; ive made a wooden cover to bolt on to keep shot/sand out and covered the ends! i want my bracing in place by this weekend so i can start to cut the inner fenders off. onwards and upwards! its 6 weeks untill the Isle of Man TT2012 so desperate to get as much done before that.

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Re: rust attack progress pics! #118
pgmidget Paul Glogowski North East PA, USA 1966 MG Midget 1972 MG Midget	Posted: April 16, 2012 05:25PM Registered: 3 years ago Posts: 171

In reply to a post by pants007,1995014,its 6 weeks untill the Isle of Man TT2012 so desperate to get as much done before that.
[/quote

Sorry for going off topic a bit ........but ......... That race event is beyond incredible, and way beyond crazy!!! I didn't know they had a Spridget class. LOL .

On topic, great thread, keep up the great work ...
Paul

[url=http://s244.photobucket.com/albums/gg23/jigholeeo/1972%20MG%20Midget/ My Midget Pictures[/url]

"It's never easy"..."but for a minute I thought it might be"

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/16/2012 06:17PM by pgmidget.

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Re: rust attack progress pics! #119
pants007 stevyn knox isle of man, United Kingdom	Posted: April 17, 2012 05:59AM Registered: 1 year ago Posts: 620

hey paul! only way mine will get round is by tow-truck! i did drive round there once and even got to 70mph down a hill; but i was sh*t scared! god only knows how they do over 200mph!
i think this will be a long thread, it should really be called rust attack avoidance!

working on drive shaft joints today and there not being very nice to me, diff was going to blasters today but thought may as well get everything together and take the lot! Got our steel fab shop getting the bracing material sorted out but dont think it will be as thick or strong as bud suggested although will be close to his design.

Hey if anyone is interested in any IOM TT2012 t-shirts, caps or something else let me know and i'll get a price! shipping shouldn't be that much for light stuff! a few months after TT the clothing price reduced by half!

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Re: rust attack progress pics! #120
pgmidget Paul Glogowski North East PA, USA 1966 MG Midget 1972 MG Midget	Posted: April 17, 2012 07:53PM Registered: 3 years ago Posts: 171

Stevyn thanks for the offer on the IOM TT swag, send me a PM on the details, I'm definitely interested.

I can feel your rust pain, as I am rebuilding/derusting a 72 Midget. I just finished both sides, (A pillers, inner and outer rockers, outer footwells and floors). I did one side at a time, starting out with bracing, but I pulled it out because it was a pain working around.. ... I had no sagging or twisting issues, I think. Because I rough fit my doors and they seem to lineup good with nice gaps all the way around however I didn't try to fit the front wings yet, but I feel good about my chances.

Paul

My Midget Pictures

"It's never easy"..."but for a minute I thought it might be"

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