Interesting MGA 1600 MK2, Thoughts needed

today i inspected a 1600 MK2. the car was all original, even the original spare and spare cover. never been in an accident no rust issues, very original and very clean. tail lights were correct and correct emblems.


however, the data plate came up as a 59 twin cam roadster per the British Motor heritage certificate. any thoughts on this?

the data plate was registered as far back as 1980.


could the heritage people be wrong? maybe more of an investigation is needed.

maybe the prior owner swapped out the data plate for registration purposes.

the vin is YD3/2241

but like i said it was as clean as a 1600 MK2 could be.

AFAIK, all twin cam VINs started with a 'Y'. The Heritage certificate most definitely should have come back as a twin cam. Looks like a VIN swap to me.

Can you find the VIN stamped on the right-hand cross member? If so, check to see if it matches the VIN plate.

Repost, sorry.

Probably a VIN tag swapped onto a good body shell, but maybe you lucked out and found a twin cam car with an engine swap.

Granted, a twin cam mill for it is a tough find, but still.

I mean stringer things have happened in the automotive collector hobby; remember when Shelby found ALL of those number chassis behind the shed, Forgotten all about 'em ! ! ! Managed to get them all matched up with some probably forgotten Cobra bodies and sold them off.

Good for him, couldn't have happened to a nicer, more honest guy . . .

something is fishy. Post pictures to help us figure it out.

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the car is all original. it has all the correct mk2 emblems.59000 miles. i think the data tag got swapped, but where else could you check the vin.

Definitely not a twin came no knock off steel wheels. Be careful someone swapped vin tags try to trace back the previous owners. It has a story hope its not stolen. Does the engine have 1622 cast in it on rh side of block under front carb. What is the engine number. Is rear end a 4.1 ratio sn stamped on the housing behind passenger seat.
Look at Moss Cataloge for location of other numbers.

This car is definitely not a Twin Cam. I own Twin Cam YD3/2040 and everything is different.
Stan Heath

That car has fraudulent title information. someone did something wrong and possibly illegal in its past. the car is a very nice looking 61-62 1600 MK11. the vin plate and title belong somewhere else. The reasons to put another vin plate on a nice car are typically fraudulent. If the history of this vehicle were to come out someone else may really own it. The title you are talking about may be for nothing more than Arizona beach front property. Check and see if there is a chassis # on the passenger floor frame rail. Originally there was a number stamped there. Though I have owned 7 MGAs I have only seen a number in that location in pictures of others cars.

There is a number on the passenger side floor. But very hard to read

I have looked at a number of As when I was looking for my late in life car. I couldn't find the number on any. The coupe I just bought has it plain as day. Love those Ca cars...

other than under the front passenger seat where else should i ask the seller look for any id information?

You'll have to talk the owner into pulling up the carpet in front of the passenger seat to check the frame cross-member, see http://mgaguru.com/mgtech/buying/buy101c.htm. Since it's probably glued down, you could be looking at new carpet and still not get the correct VIN number.

As stated, that number often doesn't stay visible once rust has gotten to it. I couldn't find a trace of it on mine.

If you can post the body number (see http://mgaguru.com/mgtech/buying/buy101b.htm), a guesstimate of the range the VIN number should be can be made.

I'd avoid this one lest it come back to bite you later.

Try your darnedest to get the VIN off the frame and ask for it to be run through California DMV. If Brit Heritage identifies the state where the car was sold new, run it through that stat'e DMV as well if not California. See if it has ever been reported stolen. Sometimes people will sell cars without title - in some states, I understand a bill of sale was all that was required in some cases. Then later, if a person tries to register in a state that does require title, and the title has long since been lost, a title and ID plate from a junker is a convenient solution to a problem. Wonder where the "junker" twin cam is ??? Theft is a possibility, but not a certainty.

....somethings odd the underneath of the bonnet seems incorrect and the batt cover is missing the handle, but I may be trying to sleuth to hard...it does look a nice car tho...I would venture the ID plate is half as valuable as the car....

Year ago, my ex brother in law stored a black '62 MGA in a storage facility here in Tennessee. He missed (or was late) on a storage payment and the car "disappeared". Maybe this is it.

how long ago? this car had CA registration since at least 1980 and has black CA plates.

Above I said "year ago". It should have said "years ago". I'd have to contact him to find out. I remember seeing pictures of him and the car taken in the late '60s. I'll see if I can find out more.

If the number is present on the frame and that VIN is clean, and the Twin Cam number on the aluminum ident plate is ALSO clean . . . well then, you buy that bad boy as soon as you can scrape the coin together ! !

With the chassis member VIN, you can strike another ident tag for it and get the title and such to register it.

With an original Twin Cam ident plate, you can get paperwork and title and start collecting the part to build your dream car or better yet, sell that tag and title to some unscrupulous bearded foreign gentleman who has a stolen Twin Cam and needs clean documents and tags for it in order to bring it to auction . . . in France . . . during the Summer . . . under gigantic lovely tents . . . full of beautiful women and rich men all dressed in evening wear and drinking the good stuff.

can someone tell me where else to look for identifying info other than the front passenger side floor?

the soft top is about 12 years old.

does anyone know of an MGA specialist in Southern California?

Bad risk to take - there have been people that bought a car with a faked transferred serial number and after they restored it, the original owner came along and got it back again. If it has been stolen, you simply can't get good title - 'Nemo dat quod non habet' - or in English, you can't give what you ain't got in the first place (i.e. clear title), and that applies in all jurisdictions I am familiar with, but check yours as there may be statutory overlays that change things locally.

Damned shame as that is a nice original car. Try and track the original serial number if you can.

It would be interesting to hear what happend to the real Twin Cam the number came from (I am at work and can't check my records to see where that car started out life).

from the heritage certificate for the twin cam it was delivered to the US.

Update: My ex brother in laws car disappeared from Olsen's commercial garage in downtown Nashville in approximately '91. He bought the car in August, 65. It was originally black but green when he lost it. He says it also had regular steel wheels, not wires. VIN GHNL2110583. He still has the title.

well if it makes you feel any better this car has been in CA since at least 1980.

...so what is its price?

One MGA expert comes to mind, but he is in San Diego. Jim Alcorn. He or someone who works for him might help you. Maybe Jim, being a Twin Cam specialist, could also assist on the car's Twin Cam ID number. Having been involved with MGAs for a long time, he might even know the car.

I have talked with Jim on the phone a few times, and he certainly is a friendly and knowledgeable guy. Coincidentally, Jim sold a black Mk 2 MGA roadster with red interior a couple of years ago on eBay. It sold for less than it should have given that his shop had freshened it, and his reputation adds value to a car that he has worked on.


http://www.autovintagery.com/

The car number is off a 59 twin cam roadster OEW with red interior and grey top.

David - if you post the engine number (found on a plate on the passenger side of the engine) and the body number (location described by Geoff) folks on the forum can tell you a lot about those parts. The number stamped on the chassis under the carpet on the passenger side of the car is the one that would tell you the number on the car's original original VIN plate. The other body number can be correlated to the point that you can get an estimate of what the original VIN was. The engine number can be correlated so you can get a sense of whether it is possible that it is the original engine for the car. I think it is clear at this point that the VIN plate on the heater shelf is from a different car. The twin cam engines where never sold with that body style and the years are wrong.

Russ

Good catch, Gil. Really, really big title mistake! I went back and looked at the title again. The number I gave above is what was shown as the manufacturer's ID number. However, outside and to the right of that number is another number--100583. I guess that's the right one.

Thanks!

--Jack