I know the horse is dead, but I still feel like his @ss : MG Midget Forum : The MG Experience

I know the horse is dead, but I still feel like his @ss #1
SwaMan Frank Clark Oswego, NY, USA Sign in to contact 1970 MG Midget	Topic Creator (OP) Oct 19, 2014 06:28 PM Joined 9 years ago 264 Posts

Finally back to reassembly of the front suspension and steering on my '70 midget after some delay.
Excited to have gotten everything together and greased up so I could at last get the wheels back on..............but it was not to be.
After my trunion position error, I thought I had made some progress, but when I mounted the first wheel, it became painfully obvious that the tierod end still makes serious contact with the inside of the wheel. ARRRRRGH!

Before approaching you kind folks with another bungle , I looked closely for other options including the suggestion of maybe needing to trip the TR stud. Sadly, I'm quite certain that the TR casting itself will still make contact with the wheel.

On another note......are the disc shields really necessary? I don't see them on modern vehicles, and they seem to be more trouble than they're worth. lots of potential for rubbing stuff if disturbed at ALL.

Thanks, as usual for your generous support!

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Re: I know the horse is dead, but I still feel like his @ss #2
Jim Gruber Apollo Beach, FL, USA Sign in to contact	Oct 19, 2014 06:34 PM Top Contributor Joined 13 years ago 1,529 Posts

Give us some pics

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Re: I know the horse is dead, but I still feel like his @ss #3
SwaMan Frank Clark Oswego, NY, USA Sign in to contact 1970 MG Midget	Topic Creator (OP) Oct 19, 2014 08:32 PM Joined 9 years ago 264 Posts

Here are a couple of pics.
As you can see, the TRE also makes contact with the disk/rotor shield when the steering is to the left.

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Re: I know the horse is dead, but I still feel like his @ss #4
AN5L8016 Mark Haynes Nederland, CO, USA Sign in to contact 1958 Austin-Healey Bugeye Sprite "Bertie"	Oct 19, 2014 09:12 PM Top Contributor Joined 11 years ago 1,451 Posts

that is, by no means, right. I've seen where the tie rod nut drags on the rim (both of my cars) but having to distort the backing plate is just wrong. When you tighten the TRE nuts down, are they still in contact? Are you sure that the TREs are right ? Any other front end mods that might be a factor?

'58 Bugeye
'05 Mini Cooper S

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Re: I know the horse is dead, but I still feel like his @ss #5
7mg2 Andrew Hardie Calgary, AB, Canada Sign in to contact 1969 MG MGC GT "Mr "C" 1972 MG Midget MkIII	Oct 19, 2014 09:37 PM Joined 15 years ago 3,617 Posts

I'd say you have the wrong TRE's.
The taper below the threaded portion of the TRE should almost reach the top of the hole in the steering arm, which also centres the threads over that hole.
The tie rod end looks to be much bigger in diameter than it should be too, which is why it hits the backing plate.

Andy

NAMGBR# 20-7738

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Re: I know the horse is dead, but I still feel like his @ss #6
Jim Gruber Apollo Beach, FL, USA Sign in to contact	Oct 19, 2014 10:29 PM Top Contributor Joined 13 years ago 1,529 Posts

Agreed , Wrong tie rod ends.

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Re: I know the horse is dead, but I still feel like his @ss #7
73midget Chris Edwards Garland, TX, USA Sign in to contact 1973 MG Midget MkIII	Oct 19, 2014 11:29 PM Joined 13 years ago 2,941 Posts

...

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014-10-19 11:32 PM by 73midget.

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Re: I know the horse is dead, but I still feel like his @ss #8
NOHOME P P O, ON, Canada Sign in to contact 1967 MG MGB GT "Maggie (GT From Hell)"	Oct 20, 2014 05:19 AM Top Contributor Joined 17 years ago 18,541 Posts

Something not right there. Why does it look like the thread is skewed in the arm?

Who sold you the TRE? Cause my guess is that it is the wrong part.

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Re: I know the horse is dead, but I still feel like his @ss #9
purpleGT Bud Osbourne Pittsburgh, PA., USA Sign in to contact 1956 MG MGA 1500 1972 MG Midget MkIII 1972 MG Midget MkIII 1974 MG MGB GT "The Grape" & more	Oct 20, 2014 05:53 AM Top Contributor Joined 15 years ago 4,501 Posts

Are both sides rubbing, or just the left? While it could be wrong tie rod ends, it could also be a slightly bent steering arm. It's been known to happen and it's certainly worth checking. I know I've seen at least one bent steering arm in my parts stash.
A few minutes of work with a press should be all it takes to correct the problem (it won't have to bend very far, at all). Or, just use a different steering arm, from a parts car or from a salvage yard.

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Re: I know the horse is dead, but I still feel like his @ss #10
66jalopy Phillip Jolliffe Lake City, FL, USA Sign in to contact 1956 Morris Minor	Oct 20, 2014 06:05 AM Joined 11 years ago 6,727 Posts

Here is an old one off of mine. 1st: 1 7/16.
2nd: 7/16
3rd: 1 11/16

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Re: I know the horse is dead, but I still feel like his @ss #11
dickmoritz Dick Moritz Philly 'burbs, PA, USA Sign in to contact	Oct 20, 2014 06:54 AM Top Contributor Joined 14 years ago 26,263 Posts

Frank,

Particularly in your photo 1189, it appears that there is excess room between the O.D. of the top of tapered tie rod threads and the bore of the steering arm. I wonder if perhaps you inadvertently put the steering arms on the wrong side of the car. Having done so would reverse the direction of the taper in the arm, and would also re-position the end of the arm, and therefore the tie rod end, possibly causing the interference problems you're having.

Tough to tell from the photos, but easy enough to determine for sure. Just pull one of the tie rods out of the steering arm and look to see if the widest part of the taper in the steering arm is at the bottom and the narrowist part is at the top. If so, then they are installed on the correct side...

Dick

Errabundi Saepe, Semper Certi
(Often wrong, but always certain)

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Re: I know the horse is dead, but I still feel like his @ss #12
66jalopy Phillip Jolliffe Lake City, FL, USA Sign in to contact 1956 Morris Minor	Oct 20, 2014 07:05 AM Joined 11 years ago 6,727 Posts

There isn't much room in there when it's right.

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Re: I know the horse is dead, but I still feel like his @ss #13
tomshobby Tom Smith Windsor, WI, USA Sign in to contact 1974 MG Midget 1976 Triumph TR6	Oct 20, 2014 07:31 AM Joined 14 years ago 1,881 Posts

It looks to me that the backing plates are the problem. There should be a notch in the plates where the tie rods fit.

Tom Smith
1974 Midget
1976 TR6

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Re: I know the horse is dead, but I still feel like his @ss #14
purpleGT Bud Osbourne Pittsburgh, PA., USA Sign in to contact 1956 MG MGA 1500 1972 MG Midget MkIII 1972 MG Midget MkIII 1974 MG MGB GT "The Grape" & more	Oct 20, 2014 08:00 AM Top Contributor Joined 15 years ago 4,501 Posts

Good eye, Dick! That could be the problem with it (reversed steering arms). And, as one of the others mentioned, there should be a dust shield cut-out where the tie rod end is interfering with the dust shield.

In reply to # 2828710 by dickmoritz Frank,

Particularly in your photo 1189, it appears that there is excess room between the O.D. of the top of tapered tie rod threads and the bore of the steering arm. I wonder if perhaps you inadvertently put the steering arms on the wrong side of the car. Having done so would reverse the direction of the taper in the arm, and would also re-position the end of the arm, and therefore the tie rod end, possibly causing the interference problems you're having.

Tough to tell from the photos, but easy enough to determine for sure. Just pull one of the tie rods out of the steering arm and look to see if the widest part of the taper in the steering arm is at the bottom and the narrowist part is at the top. If so, then they are installed on the correct side...

Dick

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Re: I know the horse is dead, but I still feel like his @ss #15
AN5L8016 Mark Haynes Nederland, CO, USA Sign in to contact 1958 Austin-Healey Bugeye Sprite "Bertie"	Oct 20, 2014 10:04 AM Top Contributor Joined 11 years ago 1,451 Posts

I just looked back at those photos, the cutout in the backing plate is below the TRE, I think the backing plates are reversed as well. I was thinking about the steering arms being reversed, but the only difference will be where the taper starts and stops (upper or lower).

'58 Bugeye
'05 Mini Cooper S

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